Welcome And Guest Intros

SPEAKER_02 0:40

Hey guys, Ryan Garland here, founder and chairman of Paradigm. Thank you very much for uh watching this uh episode. We're gonna we're gonna call it episodes because these webinars are just becoming more and more popular and we host them all the time, once a month at least. And as you guys know, I have some of the coolest people ever. And I always uh I always chase down the right talent for everyone to kind of get to know who's involved and what we do and ultimately the the sophistication to help you as an investor potentially position yourself for your future and ultimately know which decisions you need to make and ultimately just know what's out there. And so I uh I'm honored today to be uh to be uh two guest speakers, two people that I've known for a really long time, and I don't want to age us here. Really long. I know, sorry, but we have Karin Hall, which is the director of U Direct. She has actually worked with a lot of our clients for uh the IRAs and self-directed IRAs, and for some of our current network, you guys know that we have a lot of our investors invest into uh and use through uh their IRAs into our funds and into our investments. So I think it's really important because a lot of our clients don't know that you can use an IRA. And with the big blue, beautiful bill that just was released, there's a lot of uh information that I think everybody really needs to know. And Karin's gonna talk on that. So, Karen, thanks for having to be me uh being with us today. Thank you, Ryan. Appreciate it. And Nate, Nate is the like look. So let me just back up with Nate. Not only is Nate and I personal friends, we've got a chance to spend a lot of personal time together. He came out to Mechula and he's out in Dallas now, and he's got a wonderful family. He's kind of hell had a hell of a background, and he just is just one of the most sophisticated security attorneys in the space. And for those of you that are in my network, you guys know I try to surround myself around the town. And and you really want people to protect you and watch over you and make sure you disclose things properly and you're in you're in compliance. And Nate has been just an advocate for us, he's been my biggest fan when it comes to how we operate and protecting us and making sure we're doing things right and really opening up the floodgates of knowledge too, on how we should not only solicit, but how look at the market and which way the direction, which way the world's going. But he works with so many different operators and he sees things that do work and things that don't work, that it's really nice to kind of have him as a as a soundboard. So, Nate, thank you very much for joining us too today.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

Thank you. And I'm actually starting to blush. So I did say you look good again.

SPEAKER_02 3:05

I did say you're a handsome man. I was like, man, you look good every time I see you. I can't believe how good looking you are all the time. So we got to start this off. So I just want you guys, every everyone to know that Karin Hall used to actually have a voice for radio. Oh, yeah. So, Karin, give us just like your best voice before we start off.

SPEAKER_00 3:22

Okay. Uh, how about this? Smooth jazz 107.5, the oasis.

SPEAKER_02 3:29

I love it. How cool. Thank you for that. I actually want to listen to that later on this afternoon. Which which radio station was that?

SPEAKER_00 3:35

Oh man, that was uh the away, it was in Dallas, uh smooth jazz station, been in a few different markets, but that was when I was in my 20s, which was obviously just you know a scant moment ago.

SPEAKER_02 3:45

That was just a few months ago, right? Correct. I love it. Well, you know what? Let's start, let's start with you. I think this is really important. The majority of our clients, again, are utilizing IRAs and and don't know they can use their IRAs and kind of how the 401k rollovers work and so forth. So we're gonna give you the mic for a few minutes, see if we can add some value to our network and and uh kind of give us kind of an overview

Karin’s Path To Self-Directed IRAs

SPEAKER_02 4:05

of what who you are, background, what you do, and then you can talk on the big, beautiful bill, please.

SPEAKER_00 4:09

Oh, I'd love to. You know, well, I mean, like we just pointed out, my initial or first career was in radio, which I did, you know, while I did other things, but 17 years I did radio and simultaneously I did other things. I got into real estate eventually as a realtor for one year and uh but property management, managing like big little buildings and then bigger buildings, you know, and it got some of that uh behind uh behind me and then uh moved into mortgages, mortgage loan servicing, loan origination, uh, became a real estate investor. So that was a lot of years too. And and then I got I got out of radio quite some time ago. And then in the Great Recession, like, ah, I can't, I can't do what I know. I need to do something new. And so I found a J O B like a job, and I worked for a self-directed IRA company for two years and then broke off and started Udirect IRA services in 2009. So now we have $1.2 billion under management.

SPEAKER_02 5:06

So that's that's a that's an under that's an undertaking, and congratulations. I think before we even started this, I had told you how impressed I was about you building awareness of your platform. And I think all of the content, which by the way, I think it's really important to just let everybody know you wrote a book.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

Oh, yeah, I did. Yeah, in fact, wait, I might actually have it right now in my hands.

SPEAKER_02 5:27

I think that's really cool. In fact, I want to read it because I think there's a lot I don't know. I'll be honest, I'm kind of a construction guru, you know. I don't know everything there is to know about that stuff. So I I actually want to read it. And so I want to be able to what we'll do is at the end of this, within the content, we'll go ahead and provide uh everyone's contact information where to get it. And I want you to be able to share that. So that's really important when you get to a certain you know level in business. If you're able to truly provide more information for people to really dive deep into it, that's huge.

SPEAKER_00 5:57

Yeah, and it's uh I did I published this book, co-published with bigger pockets, and so it's it's really a real estate investor's self-directed IRA book, you know, and it's a a guidebook, not a storybook. It's it's something like reference, like open it up, look in the glossary, find what you need to know, and one of those kind of books. So yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:15

And that's and that's the marriage right there, right? You know, why why did we bring on one specific person to talk about IRAs? I just have seen you for years work with majority, seems like it's more real estate driven. And that clearly clears up a little bit of the the the question was you know, your background. Obviously, you were in the space. So naturally you're gonna have that type of clientele.

SPEAKER_00 6:35

Yeah, and and with the self-directed space, the assets you know in self-directed IRAs are like it like seems like about 90% real estate related. If it isn't buying the actual property, it's investing in a syndication. Nate, do you know what those are? Have

What You Can And Can’t Hold In An IRA

SPEAKER_00 6:50

you ever heard about that?

SPEAKER_01 6:51

Oh, maybe syndication, maybe more than 10 billion times.

SPEAKER_00 6:56

Yeah, yeah, sorry. Yeah, the expert in syndications over here. So no, so syndications are the number one asset class for self-directed IRAs, but it uh syndication is a is a contract. I mean, the underlying assets real estate. Uh you can buy the brick and mortar or you can make loans on real estate. So real estate is really tied to, I'd say, 90% of the assets that people self-direct into.

SPEAKER_02 7:20

Yeah, and that's really important just because you know, there's so different, so many different ways to invest the IRA into a real estate product, you know, through mortgage-backed securities and trusteed investing into multiple different funds, whether it's debt or equity funds. Uh, what are some other asset classes they can get into?

SPEAKER_00 7:38

Well, I mean, cryptocurrency, right? Uh that's that's really taking off. And, you know, and and so it's still the Wild West. It's not fiat currency, is it? It's not backed by anything, it's not like the Holland tulip, you know, craze. I think it's got a little bit more substance than that, or quite a bit more, but uh, but it's it's early days. So, but that is a huge asset class for self-directed investors. People really like it because you can take a little bit of money and just kind of play, you know, stick your foot in the water and see how it goes. So, and also we're seeing a lot of people in precious metals now, too, uh, with currency being a question. And and currency has always been based on gold, hasn't it?

SPEAKER_02 8:18

Yeah, and that just spiked a little bit earlier. If you if you can't, I know where Nate was gonna go. Go ahead, Nate.

SPEAKER_01 8:22

No, no, no. I've I've got a big question. Okay, because we talk about what can invest through the self-directed IRA, but what can't be invested through a self-directed IRA. I think that's just as equally important. Of course, real estate, you're good to go most of the time. Right. But what can't you do?

SPEAKER_00 8:44

Well, it's the list is so short. I mean, it'll take two seconds. It's life insurance contracts and collectibles, you know? So there you go. Life insurance, contracts, and collectibles.

SPEAKER_02 8:54

Well, that's easy. No, Nate, question for you. How many, how many of your syndicators and your clients and operators do you think are they targeting uh clients and investors with IRAs?

SPEAKER_01 9:07

Uh only about 110%.

SPEAKER_02 9:12

And so how much do you have any data? And I'm I know that we we haven't even talked about this, so I'm just we're kind of going off the top of our head. Do you have any information on, you know, let's say, for example, someone's raising five million dollars, what the percentages of clients and investors uh are that are utilizing IRAs?

SPEAKER_01 9:29

Well, I can tell you you're actually capped, you're only allowed to accept so much IRA qualified money. And you can't go beyond, you really shouldn't go beyond 25% of your deal from IRAs or the sponsors or you have a ton of red tape and problems to deal with.

IRA Money In Syndications And Limits

SPEAKER_01 9:50

So it it kind of is one of those, yeah, get in, get in quick because it's a limited space that the IRAs can actually play.

SPEAKER_00 9:59

I have a question for you, Nate, if I can. So is it 25%, even if real estate is the underlying asset? I thought the 25% was out the window if the underlying asset was real estate. Am I right about that?

SPEAKER_01 10:11

But people aren't investing in real estate, they're investing into an entity that it's investing into real estate, and that's the differentiation.

SPEAKER_00 10:19

Okay. Little Gene Crowbridge, you know, knowledge there from the past. So, okay.

SPEAKER_01 10:25

Yeah, and it does matter what they're investing into. So, one comment that I want to make, you know, we work with a lot of syndicators. And I I know, Ryan, you're a great, uh, great guy open to making deals, making things happen. A big thing that people talk about nowadays, it's called a fund of fund, where uh someone else can put together a fund to invest into someone else's syndication. So kind of way that you can build a team together, but it's very similar that people think, oh, I'm just investing into real estate, but you're really not. You're investing into an LLC that is investing into an LLC that eventually owns real estate, and people just don't really think step by step through it.

SPEAKER_02 11:08

That's true. You know, do you do you know? Um how you know, let me ask you this. Are you how many of your requests to start a funds is real estate based, mate?

SPEAKER_01 11:21

Uh y it's a vast majority of what we do is real estate and real estate related. But yeah, I'll be perfectly frank. The reason that it's like that, you're doing real estate deals. You do many real estate deals, it's deal after deal after deal after deal. If I start a company, maybe I do a founder raise and it's limited who gets in, I get funded, and then I'm just focused on the company. I'm not trying to raise more capital. So a lot of what we talk about is real estate because that's where the deals are at.

SPEAKER_02 11:55

Yeah, and you know, and most people want to do SPV, special purpose vehicles for each project that they're involved in, and it's really just because every project has its own merits, you know. And it seems like that's where we've been successful is kind of streamlining one project that people can really dive into to get comfortable and invest into, really get to know it instead of a portfolio. We actually tried that with our first reggae, it was kind of a portfolio, and that was also when before the SEC really allowed you to do series with inside the reggae offerings, too, if I recall. So yeah, that was really good. And I really wanted to touch on that too. And thank you for bringing that up because I would have forgot. You know, the whole fund of fund that's really kind of that family office concept where you have someone who wants to manage money or can manage money or someone that's aligned with, let's just say, us as a as an operator, and say, hey, you know, I have a group of investors, I want to participate in it. I'm gonna open up a fund, I'm gonna put 100,000 or 200,000 of my own money into it. And then I have a group of friends and family or you know, some other investors we've done other business with, but I love your model and I want to get in. So then they manage a fund and then that fund invests into our fund. And that's what the fund is, right, Nate?

SPEAKER_01 12:58

Yeah, it is, but it's like nowadays, like the fund of funds is just kind of uh nomenclature. Like people will set up a fund to invest into your specific syndication, not a whole bunch of deals like a traditional mutual fund or a private equity fund. Uh, it's just let's be honest, some people are good at operating business, some people are good at raising capital. You're one of the outliers that can actually do both, but the guys that raise capital sometimes really shouldn't be doing real estate dealing. I totally agree there. We need to work with you and people

Fund Of Funds And Deal Structures

SPEAKER_01 13:40

like you to make sure that they don't get themselves or their investors in trouble.

SPEAKER_02 13:44

Yeah, no, I appreciate that. Thank you very much. All right, Karin, let's talk a little bit about the big beautiful bill. I think there's some content we want people to know about, and uh that has kind of been one of those things that we a lot of people are calling us going, hey, we need advice, and legally we can't, you know. So this has really given us the ability to kind of shed some light and utilize our resources to to paint the yellow brick road. So if you don't mind, where are we? Where are we going in the world?

SPEAKER_00 14:08

Yeah, you know, it's big, it's beautiful, and it's bringing in alternative assets, but not like self-directed IRAs. And so there's a lot of misconception about that. So the what's on the deck right now is that IR 401k is employer plans, 40401k, 403B, 457s, will be able to invest in alternative assets. With a self-directed IRA, you just go grab that asset. It won't be like that. So in order to invest in a lot of these alternative assets, and of course, we've got you know the experts here, uh, Nate, expert of the uh accredited investor. So you have to be accredited a lot of times to get into these deals, right? So, say for example, you're working at Home Depot and you've got a 401k and you want your 401k invested in alternative assets, well, you're not accredited, possibly. You know, you you might not be an accredited investor. And so you couldn't get into that deal directly. But what would happen is say, I don't know, say John Hancock is got is got the, you know, is is the plant administrator here, whatever the the big company there, they're going to create a fund of alternative assets. So it's that level where they're getting in, they're the alternative, or sorry, the they're the accredited investor. And now got you know, person from Home Depot invests in their fund, not in the asset directly. You see? And so that's how you get past the accredited investor portion uh to have people with the 401k work in a regular nine to five job investing in alternative assets in this way. Uh so there's one thing. But another thing that's incredibly important is that yes, this bill passed, it did, but there's still some time for oversight. So the Department of Labor said they're going, they're gonna take a 180-day look at the fiduciary responsibility, you know, because we've we've got companies, we have 401ks for our companies. So we're a trustee of that plan. We have a fiduciary duty. And if we allow our employees to invest in scary assets or dangerous assets, we could be liable. So the Department of Labor has taken a look at that. Maybe they're going to indemnify um, you know, plan trustees, like employers. Uh, so we'll see what they do, but it'll be six months out uh before the DOL is gonna sound off about their findings.

SPEAKER_02 16:20

Got it. Well, let me ask you this, because I kind of I love I'm actually gonna learn a lot with you here. And I thought I didn't know more a lot, but I I always I'm humble enough to say I don't know everything. Okay, so let's let's kind of let's dissect that a little bit. So if you have a 401k, let's say it's it's housed at like uh Fidelity or uh uh what's the other few other ones? Um Schwab, yeah, Charles Schwab, what have you. The operator, someone like me that managed the fund manager, we would have to submit that fund, right? To right, okay, to and get approved on that platform, yes, right, which also requires audited financials and and yearly auditors, right?

SPEAKER_00 17:02

Yeah, well, it's TBD, it's early days, right? It just passed about

The “Big Beautiful Bill” Explained

SPEAKER_00 17:05

a month ago.

SPEAKER_02 17:06

So well, the standard process now for RIAs and so forth on some of the larger outfits is the same way. And if you have a reggae, let's say you're non-accredited, I don't think you're talking more of accredited, but even with reggaes, you have to have audited financials, Nate. If I'm correct me if I'm wrong, yes. Um, but you you know, if you're gonna go after the accredited space and that custodian, in essence, is operating as uh as the accredited, uh, yeah, so we would definitely need to be uh approved, is kind of where I think would be. I'm I mean, I may be wrong and you're right that you have to 180 days to have to figure this out, but I think that's probably the process that we want. They would vet us as a good operator and that we have the right practices in place and they would look at who our securities attorneys are and they would want to see our our uh our infrastructure.

SPEAKER_00 17:46

Absolutely, absolutely, because they're in a way they're representing you, aren't they? Out out to the out to the general public. So we'll see how this goes, but that that's a logical path because it's sort of the way that things are done already.

SPEAKER_02 17:58

You know, and I would say we've lost a lot of investors because they've wanted to use their 401ks and they couldn't because they were either still employed or a lot of FedEx, a lot of law enforcement, you know, um uh people in you know the uh medicine world, you know, so forth uh really got it had to pass on a lot of clients. And you know, they're like, well, then I'll call you when I retire. And I'm like, well, when's that? You know, I can't roll it over. So okay, any other uh anything else you want to touch on?

SPEAKER_00 18:23

Well, I think you know, that's the latest, but I just think briefly, a self-directed IRA, just to say they've been around 50 years, it's nothing new, and it's a simple process. After you've done your due diligence, you know, then that's the hard part. Then you open an account, takes 10 minutes, fund the account uh with either a rollover from a previous employer plan, IRA to IRA, you could transfer an IRA, or the third thing you could do is contribute from your own checking account. So open, fund it, and then invest. So you give us the docs, you know, and the IRA is the investor, not you, the person, but the IRA entity is the investor. And then we fund that deal from your IRA. All the proceeds go back to the IRA that owns it. And you just have to make sure that those proceed checks are always made payable to the IRA and not, ah, if they're ever accidentally made payable to you, just return that check to your depositor. Yeah, don't deposit it. Just nicely send it back, say, oh, little mistake here, let's fix this. Because if you put that check that belongs to your IRA in your own account, that could be, you know, it could lead to a prohibited transaction. So just that's an easy way to stay clear. Open fund invest, basically.

SPEAKER_02 19:31

So Rachel has a question. It says, Can you invest in an oil and gas through an SD IRA?

SPEAKER_00 19:37

You can, but uh that is it's a really interesting asset class. It's interesting because when you invest personally, like outside your IRA, you can get some massive tax breaks. And it can be great for you to do personally and not with qualified funds. Now, in qualified funds, a lot of times I know that some of the big uh oil and gas companies that are out there, they'll have a separate asset for self-directed IRA accounts. Maybe it'll be the land or it will be the business or something. It won't be the actual oil where you get the rights and the, you know, and those massive tax breaks. So there are different ways for self-directed IRA to invest in oil and gas that are different than you might, a different way than you might invest in personally.

SPEAKER_02 20:19

Yeah, and I think you're right. There's multiple ways to invest into the oil and gas industry overall. It just depends like on the nature of the structure. Great. I great. Is there anything else that we want to touch on with the big beautiful bill?

SPEAKER_00 20:30

No, I think I think that's how it applies to uh retirement. Now we had Secure Act 1.0 in 2019, Secure Act 2.0 at the very end of 2022. So the the federal government has really tweaked retirement plans. They're kind of done with that. So I'm very happy it's changed. We've had some changes. Um, so that's happened and now we're going forward. But this isn't going to change self-directed IRAs. It's going to change the employer plan.

SPEAKER_02 20:55

Yeah, you know, and it uh to be to be candid too, you know, a lot of our clients, especially if they've been with us for several years, you kind of get to know them on a personal level. And I would say, you know, a lot of the I would say institutional trading platforms, they're just not creating the returns to allow people to feel comfortable that they're going to be able to retire and have really the wealth that they need to enjoy their lives. Or even, you know, most people are trying to get worried about healthcare costs.

SPEAKER_00 21:20

It's true. Yeah, you can self-direct even an HSA, a health savings account.

SPEAKER_01 21:25

All right. Well, it's my turn to moderate because Ryan froze up. Uh so got a couple of questions for you, uh, myself.

SPEAKER_00 21:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 21:35

Uh, one from Anthony. You know, there's a lot of uh heavily discounted Roth conversions. Could you speak a little bit to what a Roth conversion from the IRA to the Roth actually really looks like? I mean, it's it's something that comes up so unbelievably often.

SPEAKER_00 21:54

Yeah, that heavily discounted really hits.

SPEAKER_01 21:56

Yeah, I don't know what that even means.

SPEAKER_00 21:58

Well, I do. I mean, if if you're going to say, like, oops, my, oh, guess what? My traditional, my asset, my traditional IRA really isn't worth that much. And then I'm gonna put it in a Roth. Oops, suddenly the value increased. Like, who knew? Uh, that looks like Roth fraud. So don't do that. But a typical normal, you know, traditional to Roth conversion is simply you open two accounts, a traditional and a Roth, you move the assets, could be cash or assets, you convert them from one account to the other. And the dollar value, the appraised value of the amount you converted, you're going to get a 1099 with that same number on it, and it will be taxable to you at your regular tax rate. So you can do that, pay the tax now and not pay the tax later. So it could be doing your retired self a favor today.

SPEAKER_01 22:42

Okay. So some more questions for you. Ryan, it it's nice to see you here. Like, we don't really need you.

SPEAKER_02 22:48

I'd like to say I had to use a restroom

How Employer Plans Might Add Alternatives

SPEAKER_02 22:50

break, but that really wasn't the case. No.

SPEAKER_01 22:53

All right. I I know it's so confusing for both investors and operators, like the investment process with an IRA because it's like, oh, I invested. Well, you did you invest or did the custodian invest? You fill out the paperwork, do I fill out the paperwork? And there's just so much confusion around this. Yeah. Can you clear the air a little bit?

SPEAKER_00 23:19

Oh, I sure sure, but for us, we have people vest as you know, non-trust custodial IRA. So actually the account holder is signing the docs, you know, in in in representing their IRA. So that makes things a little bit actually quite a bit easier. So that that's nice. Um, but then uh I IRAs aren't difficult. Once you get the docs, you've you I mean it really can be very, very simple. Where do you see a snag?

SPEAKER_01 23:47

Uh everywhere along the way because you look at like an investment document, and then there's the line that says investor, sign here.

SPEAKER_00 23:56

Oh, okay. So I sign it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:59

Custodian sign it. I know they're sending in the money. I'm not sending in the money. So it just creates so much havoc. I know there's even some medallion, and I don't even understand this medallion, but there's even a stamp there.

SPEAKER_00 24:10

Yeah, I know. Well, I think so, so if if it says FBO, so if it's like Nate or if it's the custodian for the benefit of Nate Dodson's IRA, the custodian's going to sign that. The way we vest is that the account holder can sign. Now, the the the medallion signatures, and if you don't know what that is, it's sort of like uh like a notary stamp that goes on the transfer document. And typically that is for moving large amounts of cash. It's it's kind of an old-fashioned sort of thing, and but still sometimes it's required to transfer from one IRA to another. That's when a medallion stamp comes into place. Sometimes that happens. You can usually get a medallion stamp at a bank if you need one.

SPEAKER_01 24:48

So, what you're really saying is if anybody asks for the medallion stamp, they are just old-fashioned. And they probably should get with the times talk to someone like yourself.

SPEAKER_00 25:01

Well, it's about security, you know, it is. And so every institution or every company is gonna have its own uh you know guidelines, their own security measures, or how they want to do things, or their procedures. And so uh medallion stamp is one of those procedures, or it could be.

SPEAKER_02 25:17

You know, I got a question, Karen, Karin. We're we're gonna pick on you, I think, the whole time here. Okay. So one of our uh one of our sticky uh points has always been processing. You know, that's one of the reasons why we reached out to you, um, is really trying to uh just make it smoother for the client because really there's a lot of information and content that don't they don't understand and they really don't know where to start, right? So what would be let's talk about the process with you if let's say someone's gonna move into a self-directed, open up an account with you. What's the process? And then what's your um let's uh so there's a couple couple questions. What's the process? And then what would be the engagement letter letter uh level with someone like us as far as we refer the client to you, uh investor uh you know opens up an account and then they want to invest into one of our funds. Kind of what's the standard protocol for you guys?

SPEAKER_00 26:09

Well, I it couldn't be it could hardly be easier. Do you could just you know do an email introduction if we just want to go bare bones? You could just do an email to introduction, and then from then we pick it up. We offer always a free consultation with that account holder, that that that investor, and we want to talk to them about well, tell us about the asset. What are you investing in, and tell us more about who owns the asset? Because there are rules that we haven't covered yet. They're called it's what you avoid. It's not what you do, it's what you don't do. They're called prohibited transactions. So we're gonna listen like, hey, is this prohibited? Um, so you don't have self-dealing, so your IRA doesn't invest in asset. You own, you know, they're prohibited transactions. So we're gonna listen to the investor, they're gonna tell us about their deal. And then we want to answer all their questions. Maybe they don't understand, uh I don't know, maybe how to do this or the tax deductibility or something like that. Now, of course, we're not tax professionals, but we can give general, you know, guidance on on uh how that works. So very simple, you open an account, we have a digital form, and you fill it out, just so easy. Uh, you move the money in, and we have staff that's going to really hold your hand through that process. So while the money, while you're waiting, because it can take one to two weeks for another custodian, you know, to move that money. And so while we're waiting, then we're getting the documentation from the asset sponsor. We're going to review it. And typically a lot of this is the same, right, Nate? And when you're looking at a syndication, there's a certain structure that you're looking at. So it's not like each one's vastly different. So it's not that complex for us to look at it and know what needs to go on there. And so we hold the investor's hand there too, to make sure their docs have the right information in the right place. And then

SDIRA Basics, Process, And Pitfalls

SPEAKER_00 27:50

we also want to take a look and make sure that the investor is actually receiving an asset in exchange for their money. It's just something that we like to do. But 100% of the responsibility is on the investor, the account holder, uh, to make sure they don't commit a prohibited transaction and to make sure that they're doing it right. But we're here just to guide people uh that whole way. So that that's basically how it goes, soup to nuts.

SPEAKER_02 28:11

Yeah, and what we do is we typically will send over the operating agreement, subscription agreement, and they will take a look at it, read it, get to know it. And then obviously, because the IRA account is making the investment, we have to make sure we get an account number from you guys, we put it on the document, we send it out for signature, and then we send it to you. So, really, and your team, so really are you signing it or are the investor signing? Investor signs it, but it's really signing in the behalf of the non-trust custodial IRA, right? Perfect, got it. So, as long as we have the account number on there, uh, that's really important, and the name of the custodian, correct?

SPEAKER_00 28:48

That's right. That's right. And we'll give you every everything, and it won't be a massive mystery at all because it's it's it's very cut and dry. We do this a hundred times a day at least.

SPEAKER_02 28:57

So yeah, I know you guys are a billion dollars in a management. I can only imagine at least that a day. So do you have any questions?

SPEAKER_01 29:03

Uh yeah, I I've got a question. Ron's got the same question. Now I made my investment, I gotta get my money back.

SPEAKER_00 29:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:12

What does it look like working with you? Can't the syndication just write me a check? Or like what does that process look like? Because all of a sudden you're in the middle.

SPEAKER_00 29:22

Right. Okay. So someone maybe they invest in this in a syndication. They want to leave, yeah, like an early exit, you mean?

SPEAKER_03 29:28

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:30

So we'll ask them to talk to their syndicator, talk to their asset sponsor, and tell them what their needs are. Because sometimes there is an opportunity for someone to get out of a deal early. Uh, and so that's something that an investor would negotiate with the actual company they invested with. And then that company would move the money into the IRA if, you know, once they reach that agreement. That's how that would work. Yeah, and that's true.

SPEAKER_02 29:55

We get that all the time, especially when people go through hardship, you know. We get that quite a bit, believe it or not. You know, there's sometimes we have the ability to do it, and then sometimes we really just don't. It just depends on the nature of the project and where it's at, and so forth.

SPEAKER_00 30:07

You bring up a really huge point. Uh, it really triggers something for me to say. And that is sometimes when people invest in uh in syndications, now tell me what you think, but they don't necessarily understand that they're there's no promise to repay that. And what they're really doing as an investor is like partnering in a way with that asset sponsor, like, hey, we're both going to try to make this work, we're gonna do our very best, but we're sharing the risk.

SPEAKER_02 30:32

Yeah, and it's we say the same thing. We're all in the same boat with the same row. We're just the one with the strong back and doing all the heavy lift to try to get the deal done. And that's exactly I love the way you said that because it really that's why they call them limited partners. You are a partner, you know, in the investment. So it's it's true. And then, you know, again, the nature of the investment too, a lot of the times in real estate, depending on the nature of it, uh, and I'm gonna talk really kind of our side because we don't want to construction, right? We have to build the thing, we have to have a capital event, whether we finish it, refinance it, or sell it, uh, we really can't re return capital. So it's so important that clients, investors really know what they're getting themselves into and when they part ways, try to stick with the the length of the project, but also know, hey, the world kind of kicks us in the teeth with tariffs and other things. You know, sometimes it takes longer to build or develop. And we've had that too. You know, I mean, we've had a lot of ups and downs. And hey, you know the stories, man. You're probably getting it from everybody. Everybody across the country has issues, and it's hard to get materials and you know, certain uh electrical components, as an example, has been kind of a pain in the butt. Garage doors for us has been a pain in the butt. You know, it's just one of those things that for big to make big money, it's not easy. Somebody always tells you to fight all the way through.

SPEAKER_00 31:45

You know, we're just then you got the black swans, like all of a sudden rates go up 4,000% or something like that. And you didn't really plan for we've seen a lot of uh even today, we have uh IRA account holders, investors who have invested in syndications and they got a capital call. And some of them don't understand why they would get a capital call. So it's just so important to understand your asset before you invest. And that's because it's like, no, you're supposed to pay me. I don't pay you, you pay me. And but you know, but you're sharing that risk. Well, we, you know, we need to do this, and we, you know, because of the rates went up, we had to reinstate our debt at a higher rate. And so now we've got a different cash flow. And you know, and then you explain it, we're all gonna win, but we all have to row together. I think that that's that that's what you say, right?

SPEAKER_02 32:29

Yeah, oh yeah. Well, and in probably in some cases more than that, you know, we really the idea is to understand really kind of those the sticking points of the project. Um, and then, you know, for again, I'm just kind of speaking for us, you know,

Oil, Gas, Metals, And Crypto In IRAs

SPEAKER_02 32:40

with the sticking points of the project, what are the main hurdles? I think with our experience now, we really can articulate it in a way that pretty much anybody can understand our hurdles, right? And and that's one of the things too, is we've had people where they're like, well, we really didn't know what we're getting ourselves into. We're like, okay, we don't want people to feel that way, you know. So we're spending more time doing these types of things where we're building the content, allowing everybody to take as long time as they want to watch videos, you know, read the documents, ask questions from either anybody on my team or myself, you know, and really kind of give them an overview. And one of what's what I think helps, and I I say it respectfully, a lot of times I'd like to get to know my investors and kind of have they've invested in something like this before. How you know, what do you do for a living? It kind of gives me an idea where they are and knowledge, uh, so I can then touch on things they may not know or what they should know.

SPEAKER_00 33:28

Yeah, know your investor is huge, isn't it?

SPEAKER_02 33:31

Mm-hmm. And you know, when you have good, when you have a good, you know, one thing I've realized is that when you communicate well and you're transparent, it's okay when you have hardships. A lot of people just they they're they're the ride to wave with you. They're totally okay. It's the non-communicative holding things back that really creates a problem, right? So when you when you really do open up to your clients and kind of give them everything to consider on the front end, you can call them down the road and say, hey, are you sitting down or standing up? Sit down for this one. But hopefully we have a solution, you know.

SPEAKER_00 34:01

Yeah, you know, because some people, it's like their pride, they don't want to say we're having a problem. And that's when you that's when uh an asset sponsor like you, I mean, you know, you like you need to be a humble guy because you've got to say, you know what, the world isn't perfect. And here's an example. Like you said, are you sitting standing up or sitting down, you know, and you've got to think, but we're gonna get through this, and this is how. And you you show them a plan, a plan forward, and like everybody gets it. It's you what what hurts is when someone's afraid to say that there's a problem instead of just, hey, you know, life happened, here we go. So when people are afraid to tell you there's a problem, you need to be knocking on that door as an investor. Like, look, I know there are problems, just tell me what it is, right?

SPEAKER_01 34:38

Yeah, I could speak on this just a little bit because of so much of what I've seen in the syndication and frankly, just economic world, macroeconomics. It's been tough for a lot of syndicators over the past couple of years with costs going up, inflation, interest rates going up. But one of the toughest things that people don't recognize is the stock market. It's been going gangbusters for the past few years. That's been a lot of where to invest, but now it's like this big bubble. And there's such a huge risk of that bubble just bursting. I mean, you talked about the Great Recession 2008, 2009. I was in the epicenter of Las Vegas at the time. These things happen, and when they happen, they happen fast. Yeah, and so it is really right now that you know, if you're heavily in the stock market, investing into those hard assets that regardless of what happens, there's value in the real estate. There's that perfect saying or that traditional saying, there's never going to be more of it. Yeah, that's so true. So I do think over this next year, I mean, it's been a tough time, but interest rates are starting to come down. The government is at least trying to stabilize pricing to help. But also, we're going to start, and it's already beginning, having an outflow from the stock market into real estate. So the gains are starting to well, just

Paperwork, Medallion Stamps, And Vesting

SPEAKER_01 36:20

frankly, look nicer where the real estate markets are going. So I just kind of want to give that more macroeconomic. Let's be honest about what's going on.

SPEAKER_02 36:29

You know, Nate, there's so much truth to that. Um, I would agree with you when you watch Warren Buffett, you know, pull $278 billion out of the stock market, put it into a put it into a uh uh, what was it?

SPEAKER_01 36:41

He put it into, I think put it in a JP Morgan, he put it into some sort of uh bank account, in essence, you know, um to just he owns more of the treasury bills than the Federal Reserve does. Oh yeah. Like he's pulling out, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:56

And but did you see what was it, five or eight hundred million dollars in DR Horton and Lenar, and he went wall in. You know, he he for he went into a cash position for a very long time, and he just started watching. He goes, All right, I'll go ahead and dump 800 million dollars into you know residential builders. I thought that was pretty impressive. And if you look at those builders, you it and that was what I think that's the key. Like what where is where was the capital going? That means they're saying something we're not necessarily seeing, which is great to kind of keep an eye on that. But they invested into two builders that I think are two kind of different worlds, and that was a big eye-opener for me. Lenar, I would say, is probably a higher end builder, and most times the more primary markets they love kind of an upper class, larger lot, a little higher dollar amount price point. And then you have D.R. Horton, which is a little bit more on the attainable side. So the fact that he just went into residential uh all the way through was really impressive for me. And that's that's I think that's a testament to what you just said, you know, the stock market. And then we have clients too that are just so tired of the volatility and the anxiety they get with the with the market going up and down. People are liquidating now, going, I see it, I feel it, I've been doing this for 20, 30 years. I need to get into something that's stable, that has a three, four-year run, and I just don't have to worry about it, you know. But I get some I get some cash flow, maybe they diversify into some accumulation and equity play. They get some cash flow, they try not to lock up their capital too long. You know, that type of stuff has been kind of the nature of our conversations lately. So I really appreciate you talking on that.

SPEAKER_00 38:24

Yeah, I mean, after out of the recession, didn't home builders stop building for about 10 years? Isn't there still like a deficit that that has never been brought level? I mean, they they just haven't built enough houses. So I could really see that. And and uh there's definitely supply and demand and throw in there people, probably like all of us who have houses that are at 2.75%. Am I right? And so would we ever sell that house? No, we wouldn't. So it it locks up that inventory. So we we have to build that that makes a lot of sense to me.

SPEAKER_02 38:54

You nailed it. All right, Nate, since we uh we kind of stole this for the last 30 minutes, I really wanted everyone to get to know you more. So, and I and I and if you don't mind, let's go a little bit about your background. I think what I love about you the most is not only my personal relationship with you, and I can tee off on that for hours, but I love the fact that you acquired a law firm and that a lot of your old attorneys actually came and now work with you, that you've had work with you in the past. And so, you know, I think that's a niche in itself that a lot of people don't understand because that's really kind of a private equity play. I mean, you are that mind. And then you obviously have the polish in regards to the security side. So I I just want everyone to really get to know you a little more because I would recommend you, and I already do, as you know, I send as many people as I can your way. But anybody who's watching this that has thought about opening their first fund or it's a 10th fund or it's a unique structure that you just need other people as an advisor to kind of guide you in the right direction and even bring that insight about the market and will it be successful? You know, and I think that's really important. So, Nate, if you mind, give us a little more about your background.

SPEAKER_01 39:54

I I will get do the humble brag as good as I can. But uh no, I I'm not just like that traditional attorney. I'm not just out there. I I've honestly actually never even been to court and like argued a motion, it's just not what I do. I used to be a stockbroker, just selling investments just like Ryan, just like a lot of the syndicators out there going and hey, what makes sense? How do you move money around? One of the first lessons I got as a little kid learning how to read on the Wall Street Journal. If you want to make the money, you got to learn to work with the money, how to invest the money. So I became a stockbroker after a little while, and then uh we don't need Ryan. So eventually I end up uh going into law school. It was actually after the uh internet bubble popped. So have a lot of experience with bubbles popping. Ended up becoming an attorney, went right back to doing the investing, but on this side, it's on the representative side. I was there in uh Las Vegas in 2008, and you know what? It was the other bubble popping. Now this was real estate, but you know what? There were more millionaires made out of that recession than ever before. Yeah, so it's like that's huge, but you know

Handling Distributions And Early Exits

SPEAKER_01 41:20

what? I'm also a big beneficiary of that because then I started syndicating with partners, and we acquired 4,000 multifamily units over a matter of four years. I don't even know, Ryan, if you knew this, but uh I knew you were doing it a little bit, but I didn't know you were to that level. That's huge. Oh, talk the talk, walk the walk, and then I started buying law firms, and uh actually I have my fifth law firm is closing this week.

SPEAKER_02 41:45

Congratulations! How cool!

SPEAKER_01 41:47

Entrepreneur through and through. And I I just I love to help people reach their goals. I love business, the strategy, the creativity, and how to reach really the new heights. And I'm here to help you and everybody else that doesn't understand Ubit and whatever else comes to the table, because I think that's one of the most things. I get asked about that the most.

SPEAKER_02 42:12

The most. Nate, you know what? So let's talk. I got a couple questions for you. So, one someone that's in the real estate space, like an operator like me, let's say it's their first fund. What is the hardest, what's one of the hardest things to overcome uh for a first-time fund manager?

SPEAKER_01 42:30

I'll give you the two worst things in the world is if you open up your own fund, you don't have a track record.

SPEAKER_03 42:37

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:39

You're raising capital, you're telling a good story, here's what I plan to do. But if the proof is in the pudding, they don't have that. And that's really where it's easier for people that are just getting started to do more of a fund of funds, meaning working with experienced, accomplished operators. But also, you bring up a fund. A fund traditionally means I can't even tell you what I'm going to invest into because it's into a bucket of money that I'm gonna invest someplace. That's way more difficult. And frankly, investors they don't like it quite as much because they don't know where the money is going. They're not looking at the land, the demographics, what's getting built there, really able to judge the operator beyond just the hey, I'm gonna raise some money and invest into real estate. So between the unknown of I don't know what to invest into, and the I don't have a track record either, those are the biggest hurdles of opening up a fund. And you know what? To be perfectly honest, that's where both of those biggest hurdles get solved by working with current operators, the guys that have already been there, the guys that can say, This is the property, this is the deal that we're working on, this is my track record. And then as a new fund manager, you can borrow that credibility because it's not really on you to make the money, it's on these guys to make the money.

SPEAKER_02 44:15

Right, totally agree. Okay, so let's let's talk about, let's say somebody wants to open up a fund. What's what's the process? We uh let's say I have a friend I want to introduce to you. Obviously, we email you, or they contact you guys, or call your call your main line. What's the first step, if you will, besides an engagement letter? We all know that happens, but let's talk about what you what do you do? Is there a consultant? Is there one is like a consultant, an hour consulting, kind of getting to know who they are and what they're trying to accomplish?

SPEAKER_01 44:42

You know, we're unique, so I'm gonna speak about us and then them being all the other attorneys that are out there. You know, we expect people to just come to the table with a napkin and a dream. What are you trying to accomplish? And then we take the time to back into not just what's legal, but the reality of what's going to sell, what are investors into, what terms are expected in the market nowadays because that always shifts and changes. So great to work with the experienced guys, they know what they're doing, but the new fund operators that I haven't really done this for a long time. That's a lot of where we take them by the hand, spend that time going through more of a consultative process. And it's not until somebody says, Okay, I get it, I understand. Here's the deal, here's the terms. Now let's go. And at that point, we get everything together. It's a couple of weeks because we know what we're doing, and this is all that we do.

SPEAKER_02 45:53

Yep. Then you have a great disclosure package, you kind of think all the way through and let everybody know the risks, which is really important that people know what the risks are before they make the decision to invest. So I that's one of the things I love about you. And I think that's where a lot of operators, including myself, when I first started going, hold on, you put all these risks in there, you don't want to scare people away. But there is, there is, there's so much truth to just full disclosure and explaining to people what they're getting themselves into. And that's what I love about you guys. And the

Risk, Capital Calls, And Communication

SPEAKER_02 46:20

more I season myself, and not to say I have this gray hair here, but the more I season myself in the space, the more I actually truly enjoy people believing in my dream. So it's more like if I can articulate what we're getting ourselves into as best I can, and someone sees it and feels it excited about it, it makes me feel great, even when they know the risks. You know, they're like, okay, I get it. And what's nice is that I I it's my own coined term, forgive me, but I call it smart investors. These are these investors that, you know, know what they're they like, for example, they know the area. Like I'm gonna use Lake Avisoo, for example. A lot of my investors, they are from Lake Avasu or they travel out here. So they know the area, they know the demand, they they already have their own uh experience with that area, right? So that's what I love about uh working with investors that know what they're getting themselves into, but then also kind of getting into the weeds. And a lot of times I'm learning that people ask questions about maybe construction that they may not know, but they feel comfortable enough to ask questions that's not really you know relevant to the investment strategy, but they just are curious about what's happening, you know. And I that's the fun part, you know, and and I think when you get to a point as an operator and as a fund manager where you can have fun with that and you're building those relationships with your clients, that's where you win. That's where the success is. And that's when, you know, regardless of what goes on, where you have a win or a loss, you know, a lot of investors will trust in you and keep investing with you, uh, even if you've had some hard times. And so again, that's that relationship building that I try to teach. In fact, uh, Karin, when I'm doing the, I'm gonna be in um in Tulum and speaking at Rich's yeah, event, I'm actually going to bring that up about how this is such a relationship business. If you don't put that first, you're not gonna, you're not gonna be able to really um be successful, you know, all the way down to my contractors and my subs and the city, right, for approvals and planning. I mean, it's a relationship business from soup to nuts. So I try to advise people to always make sure that you look at it from that standpoint. If you start off that way, you'll probably be successful.

SPEAKER_00 48:18

People invest in with people they trust.

SPEAKER_02 48:21

Yeah, and there's so many. I tell everybody else, oh, you can log on to social media and find another investment, another syndicator out there. People invest into the operator. They really do. They want to know that that's someone they feel good about, they get the warm and fuzzies, they trust them, and you know, they're gonna protect their investment the best they can. You know, they can't make promises, but they can make the best, you know, try to do the best they can, and that's always important.

SPEAKER_01 48:41

So you know, you bring up social media, and anybody can get on there and see there's 10,000 ads, and but the reality is, is the guys that are promising the world, and so many of them are like, you can get this 25% annualized return in two weeks. No, I mean you have to look past the the pretty promises that don't really work out, and it truly is about the relationship and about working with the people that of course know, like, and trust. Yeah, we say that, but it's honestly, I would tell my grandma that make sure you're working with people that you again know like and trust.

SPEAKER_02 49:23

Let me ask you this, Nate. So, one of our funds, our secured income funds, more of an institutionally designed fund. You know, it's more mortgage-backed securities, it's a lending arm. You know, Karin, you know a lot about this. Um we what we what we do is we try to provide a lot of supporting data, why this investment is a good idea or what we see that's relevant, and then let investors see that data as well. Uh, you know, Green Street Advisors is a great company to pull from for data uh from an institutional level. They work with pension funds, hedge funds, anybody in the real estate space, um, from you know, hundreds of millions of billions of dollars in in uh in assets to to track, but also provide that type of data to operators to then pass on to their investors. Would you say that the the fund managers, the operators, the successful, more successful ones are the are the funds that are created with that type of data and third-party reports and transparency components to it?

SPEAKER_01 50:21

I I think you just mentioned the most important thing is the transparency for the investors. Of course, to make the right decision, you need data. Data is the most important thing in the world. Uh, people don't even realize that. I mean, think of all these internet companies, the Amazons. It's like the reason why they're huge and big is because they have all the data that you don't. The same thing applies in doing real estate deals. The data is out there, but you know what? The institutions, the private equity, the guys that are in the business, they receive it for making the right decisions for their business, but also for the investors. You should be asking these same questions. You should be asking for the same data. And if the guys that you're working with don't have it, maybe they're not making the best decisions. So having it and communicating it, but also being transparent. The good, the bad, the ugly, this is what's going on in the world is truly what makes the well, the relationship work from the syndicator to the investor and building that confidence.

SPEAKER_02 51:34

Let me ask you this, and this is going to be a little loaded, so I may you may have to think about it. Which asset class have you seen? And let's talk about recent because we always have cycles, right? So let's just talk something about recent. What with the operators and everyone that you work with opening funds, what asset class

Markets, Rates, And Macro Shifts

SPEAKER_02 51:50

seems to be shining the best? Uh, and and and is a good strategy moving forward?

SPEAKER_01 51:57

Hotels, hospitality.

SPEAKER_02 52:00

I like that idea. Is it the whole Airbnb thing too?

SPEAKER_01 52:04

Airbnb is actually a thing of the past. I know it is not the best place to invest today because it's oversaturated, it's expensive, and of course, now the hotels are coming back and saying, you know what, if you're our competition, we're gonna try to squash you. But we got some money, so we're gonna try to get some regulations to make your life tough as well. So don't necessarily encourage people to go the Airbnb route, but hotels, hospitality, and also I hate to say this and admit this. Our economy is great because of the top 20 of the wealthy and the earners. So luxury condos, luxury, you know, building the the lake barns, like the things that the wealthy can afford. This is different from the past. Yeah, like they have the money that can do the deals. Yeah, so that uh is what I really see working out today that has just been different. I mean, you talk about cycles. Here's a cycle of where we're at, and it's really macroeconomic causes.

SPEAKER_02 53:15

Are you seeing are you seeing a lot of operators starting to move in different markets geographically as well? They're not just let's say someone's from Southern California or just Dallas. Are they starting to venture off into other states and other markets? Are you seeing that diversification now too? We see that. Ish, yeah, yeah, yeah. Karen, you're seeing that a lot.

SPEAKER_01 53:33

I mean, yeah, a lot of it where the hot spot to do the deals, it always moves. Texas is always a hot market, Nashville has been huge for a long time, Arizona goes back forever, California.

SPEAKER_02 53:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:48

But it is like well, you know, I was thinking about moving back there, but then I bought a place in Spain, and I'm so much happier than I was.

SPEAKER_02 53:59

And the price point, I remember when you sent me the video of that place. I'm like, wait, how much did you buy this for again? That was awesome. I mean, you were like, I mean, it's beautiful, it's beautiful. Good, good for you. I remember you back towards like tomato Fallbrook, wasn't it? When you were looking at something out in Fallbrook, you know what?

SPEAKER_01 54:14

Just total side story. Yeah, but the three things that I was looking for near the water with space and a school, good school district. Yeah, you could have two out of three, but good luck finding all three. So we kind of settled on well, if we can be right next to the water in Spain, we already got the space in the school district here. We can just fill in the pieces, and uh, you know, my my girls, my wife, well, you love it. So looking for our best life. And you know what? That's because frankly, we invested smart, we work with the right people, and it's all about partnerships, to be honest.

SPEAKER_02 54:51

I love it. Okay, so let's talk about stuff that also is really important, in my opinion, from a compliance side. So, you know, what what do you advise your clients? You know, kind of the best practices. I know that's kind of a loaded question because it can go a million different ways. Just whatever's off the top of your head. What's best practices when it comes to compliance? Whether it's, you know, from let's just say it's a 506C, uh a private placement memorandum. Do you advise that they should have audited financials? Um, or do you, depending on the nature of it, like let's talk a little bit about the compliance, the accredited investor uh side of things as well?

SPEAKER_01 55:24

Uh a little bit of a loaded question, as you were saying. But uh yeah, when we were working with somebody, the first question is where are your investors going to come from? How are you going to find them? Because that really dictates what regulation you can work with.

SPEAKER_03 55:41

Right.

SPEAKER_01 55:42

So accredited, non-accredited, there's there's strategies and styles for all of that. So best practice is figure out what makes the most sense for your business. Best practice in working with investors is say what you're gonna do and do it.

SPEAKER_02 55:59

You know, and you you guys, I love the fact that you guys are uh for a long time were looking at a lot of our marketing content before we sent it out. I thought that was really neat and really amazing because you know, when we were first getting into it, we didn't know we had to have certain disclosures on our pitch decks and even some of our marketing content on uh, let's say uh Meta, right? Or some of that. And I I thought that was really neat because disclosures are such an important thing when you're dealing with, you know, raising capital and solicitation. I mean, you're dealing with SEC oversight, and uh, I think a lot of people get in trouble if they're not disclosing it properly. And I think that is where I try to tell my friends and family they're getting into opening funds and managing that you really want someone that can help you oversee that, but are gonna basically help protect you, but it's at the same time protecting the investor because you're ultimately just providing disclosures of what

Builder Signals And Housing Supply

SPEAKER_02 56:50

you need to know before you get involved, but then also saying, hey, look, if your investor signs off on this because they've read everything, then you're protected as well, you know. And I think that's really important. And what I was also telling people is a lot of times you have, you know, investors go through hard times that are in a fund, and you have multiple investors in that fund. And so the last thing you want too is maybe one person that just has gone through a hard time to have now a direct impact on all these other people too, right? And that is something I think most people don't talk about uh that I wanted to bring up. That uh, you know, is there is there a standard practice, like let's say, and forgive me, I'm just gonna throw this out there. You know, if let's say uh if someone has, you know, is raising a million dollars and they have more than four investors, five investors, seven investors, is there like a standard practice to have a disclosure package?

SPEAKER_01 57:42

Uh my opinion is two investors, and I don't care if it's a small investment, it really is about disclosing what you're doing, disclosing about yourself, your business plan, and the risks. People ask, well, when do I need to hire a securities attorney? Well, the answer is anytime you're pulling together people's money, and you know what, there's not a grandma exemption. Like even within your family, you gotta pay attention to these things. But the real reason why to have a disclosure document, even if like legally there's some things that you don't have to disclose, best practice is to make sure it's all disclosed because it's not about when things go right, it's about when things go wrong, right? And besides pissing off grandma, you gotta make sure that you're protecting your investors to begin with, but ultimately protecting your family and by doing things right, and if you don't disclose what you're doing, things go wrong. That's when lawsuits happen, that's when complaints, that's when audits happen. And all of a sudden you say, Well, I told you. And then the investor says, No, you don't, didn't you told me something else, you lied to me. Well, now if it's in this disclosure document, this is what I said is gonna happen. This is what it says is gonna be the risks. Well, now it's in writing, so don't lie. There's always a risk in investing.

SPEAKER_00 59:20

This is why we always tell people understand your asset. And I think you just told a self-directed IRA investor how to do their due diligence. You know, read those disclosures, read the disclosures first, read them carefully, and you'll understand all the risks.

SPEAKER_02 59:34

It's so it really is so important. Now, more on the sophisticated operators, do you guys provide funds that have the correct verbiage for placement agents, RIAs, broker dealers, um, you know, all of that fun stuff that is also a little more complicated? And then also, you know, can you guys take an operator, let's say someone who's very seasoned and has a track record, do you have the capacity to build out an offering to go public?

SPEAKER_01 59:59

Yeah, we we help with, I know we're called crowdfunding lawyers, but we do everything from those little deals all the way up to those IPOs and Pubcos and REITs, and yeah. I mean, we've we've got some well-known names that we work with that are doing massive, huge deals that they started with a little syndication, and now some of these people are nationwide. So it it really is, yeah. And that's part of the planning process. What are your goals? And if you're looking to use broker dealers, RIAs, there are certain things that you need to build into it. Yep. And again, just don't try. Trust every syndication attorney because a lot of them are one trick ponies. Think that you don't need to worry about 25% with real estate.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:52

Well, okay. So let's let's talk about something even deeper because I really do value our relationship. And you I and for those of you that can imagine, you know, with an operation that size of ours at this point, we really just need those people to watch over us. Nate, those guys that started with first syndications and now you've kind of taken zero to a hundred. How's your relationship with those guys? Is it more personal? Do you have in-depth knowledge of their friends and family and talk to them all the time when

Nate’s Background And Track Record

SPEAKER_02 1:01:20

the market's getting weird and what the hell's going on? I mean, you're you're you have a personal relationship with your operators.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:26

Uh, I hate to say that is a benefit and an absolute curse. Yeah. And absol I still have the same clients from 16 years ago.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:37

Like through the good times and the bad, they have issues that you know, you have a problem with a project, it rolls into family and stress. So part therapists, part best friends, part drinking buddies.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:53

Yeah, like I could have sworn I didn't get a college that I didn't go to good school to be a cosmetologist. Jeez, I didn't know. That's so true. You're kind of a psychologist all the way through. Well, I really appreciate that. Is Nate, is there anything that you want to touch on that maybe I didn't that you want the audience to know?

SPEAKER_01 1:02:10

You're you're covering everything so amazingly. I'm just here to be that uh, as you mentioned, the pretty face.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:17

Karin, how about you? Is there anything else you want to touch on?

SPEAKER_00 1:02:20

I think a takeaway with when you think about retirement accounts is make a contribution, you know, invest in yourself. And as a Amanda Hahn, my my uh CPA and a great uh a great CPA, she says invest uh, you know, invest in yourself and and uh you know and and pay yourself and not the IRS. So that's what I suggest. Go make a contribution to your to your retirement account.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:45

I love it. Now that Ryan's gone again, I his uh internet is probably just having the weirdest time. Actually, that's why I came home. I was having problems in my office as well. So, you know what? Forget you, Ryan.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:59

Clearly, hey, please share your contact information. I'll just make it over next time I do this. If that's what's going on, man. Jeez, goodness gracious. I'm like, I know what I'm gonna I went to my house too, thinking I'm gonna have better internet here. And apparently I wasn't right, so whatever. Maybe I'll just disclose that next time. Hey, if I you know, if I just disconnect, it's not because I'm really using the restroom, it's my internet. So I'll make sure to put the right disclosures in.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:27

This has been gone for a really long time.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:29

Yeah, you know, yeah. I'm actually sweating, I ran really fast. So, well, thank you guys so very much. It's an honor to have you a part of my platform. I feel I really do feel blessed because I know when I can hand stuff to you guys, I we just don't worry. You got the best of the best. And so for those of you that are watching or listening, feel free to reach out to these two. Uh, if you have questions about your IRAs, just the knowledge that's in this room is is priceless to have in your corner. So thank you guys very much. And we'll uh we'll see you guys all soon.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:54

Awesome. Thank you. Important thing before you go, Karin, how do we get a hold of you?

SPEAKER_00 1:04:01

Oh man, udirect I R A.com. We're all over social media, but our website, we have so many blog articles. If you have a question, we've got it answered in a blog article, I'm sure. But again, it's udirectira.com.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:14

And I will be a little bit more personal. Just shoot me an email, Nate Nate at investmentlawyers.com. Love to hear from you.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:23

Perfect. Thank you guys very much. Have a wonderful day, and we'll see you soon.